On today’s episode; we introduce our very first guest, Jamie! Jamie, a microbiologist, talks about what it’s like to be a woman in STEM, but first we all get a bit derailed when the topic diverts to cake farts.
Listen to the full episode:
Show Notes and Resources:
Are you a woman in STEM? Do you have a crazy story about cake farts (or something not about cake farts)? Or do you have any questions you’d like to ask our lovely guest, Jamie? Write in to firstname.lastname@example.org or connect with us on social media at:
Check out on of Jamie’s favorite studies on Women in STEM here: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3478626/
Become a Women AF Podcast Patreon supporter for exclusive behind the scenes material, to have an opportunity, submit questions for a listener’s FAQ, vote on topic ideas, and get a bunch of great freebies - like Merch! (Who doesn’t love merch)!
Transcript for Episode 6: SCIENCE!:
Women AF 0:00
This is a mortar box media podcast for more podcasts and to learn how we can help you create your own visit mortarboxmedia.com
Welcome to Women AF the podcast hosted by three friends who have bonded over entrepreneurial dreams potty training gone wrong and dreams of dismantling the patriarchy. Oh and murder Podcast. I am your host Danie and I am joined today by my co host, Carrie.
And because I'm nervous and we're just going to go straight into the introduction. This is our first episode that we have a guest joining us. So we are have my cousin in law, Jamie joining us. Just a quick introduction and then can BS little bit because that's the fun stuff, right? Jamie is super awesome. And she is a woman in science
Danie and Jamie 1:11
We missed our queue Carrie!
I didn't know that was a thing!
Danie and Jamie 1:18
um, and recently we were hanging out for, you know, Christmas family stuff. And I thought, I mean, Jamie and I and spouses, hang out and do game nights and stuff periodically, but I never really reached out more frequently because I thought Jamie was too cool for me. But she recently told me that she doesn't think she's too cool. Um, when we brought up the idea of a guest, I was like, Hey, I have an idea. And that's how we're here.
I also kind of begged to drag me into this because I've always wanted to be on a podcast.
I got to be friends with someone who's too cool for me. And you got to be on podcast Win win. It's a win win. So yeah, but actually, I wanted to ask Nicole
Oh, that's me
before as before we get started yeah Nicole we have been dying to hear a story from you for like three weeks. Oh my gosh yeah cuz Adam doesn't let us talk to each other - as we've said that on all platforms. We are only allowed to talk to each other if it's pre-approved by him.
Well, I guess my so I have an awkward Nicole story, which I feel like we can make a whole segment on like how awkward Nicole is all the time
noted for future.
Yeah, okay. Yeah. So this in this week's episode of awkward Nicole. I have Have so you know so I go to church and you know when that awkward part right, right after worship and you greet people you're like, hey,
yeah. Shake your hands with the people around you.
Yeah as like, Hey, get to know your people. So I, you know, you're what you're supposed to do is shake hands. Say good morning. Sit down real fast. Like super fast like, like you're on a game show fast. Okay, well, I didn't do that I was shaking hands and then my mouth just like went without me understood like I was drunk. I wasn't drunk at church, but it felt like I was. So I was shook her hand and ice. I said, Wait, do you volunteer on here because I feel like a recognize your face. I said it like that. And she. She stopped and she's like, Oh, yeah, I think I recognize your face, too. Which I know she didn't like, there's no way she was appeasing me. I'm like, Oh crap, but I'm in it. Like, I'm in it for all of it. So I have to just keep going with it. So I'm like, oh, when we started comparing notes and like, well, Where do you work? Do we have that in common? Nope. And we went through the whole list of like, Where do you live? Where do you work and this whole list and out of nowhere she's like, Oh, no. Okay. And we just like sat down. I'm like, oh, gosh, now, I just made an awkward person of me.
So you didn't know her?
Yeah, I didn't know her.
You didn't know her at all.
I had no idea who she was. So I just went up and just sat down and I'm like, this is awkward.Of course.
I bet you do though.
There's the same thing. Yes, I know her or she's got a twin or a doppelganger.
She would have said she had a twin.
Yeah, I think how we ended it was like okay, well, I guess I know you in a past life and I just like sat down.
That's fine. That's that awkward. You had to ask.
Right. Yeah, I think that's normal. I recognize people's faces and not their names all the time.
But do you ever say it? Like, for me, that's what was awkward is like, I sometimes recognize people and then I kind of play dumb like, Oh, I guess we do know each other. When for some reason my brain was like, You must say it.
Usually what happens is, if I see somebody recognize I don't remember I try to hide.
Oh, yeah, yeah.
So that they don't try to communicate with me and then me not have that awkward moment where I'm like, I don't really know who you are. Yeah, I mean, like I remember. And then or if I like remember who they are, but I can't remember their name. That's the other thing. That's really hard. Oh, man.
And I've lived in like, what feels like a million different places.
So it's like, it doesn't make it any easier.
Yeah, you see someone you're like, Okay, do I know you from this place or that place? And I feel terrible for having forgotten their name.
What do you do in that moment? Do you have like a method? Do you like... Hey, honey? Yeah.
Well, I don't talk to people so...
Just put your head down and run!
Does that happen to you? Yeah, yeah. What do you do?
Hey, just a "Hey!" and a head nod and keep moving.
I have a thing that I do with Daniel and maybe I shouldn't say this on the air because I don't remember their name. But I'll and I'll be like Hey, have you met my husband Daniel? Honey, can you introduce yourself? And that's how he knows I don't remember their name. And he'll say Hey, I'm Daniel, what's your name? And then that's the time he remembers if he doesn't remember then I'm like, shoot. What do I do
What if you're alone
I'll do the same thing. This is my husband
And you'll just point to the air
And then they run
works either way. Yeah. If you think I'm crazy. You won't to talk to me. Yeah.
Yeah, I think that makes sense. I like that. I think it works.
So what we're saying is it really wasn't that awkward. I don't think so.
I hope not. I'm sure it was. I'm just not remembering all the details.
No. It was fine.
Yeah, I agree.
That's good. Thank you guys. I appreciate it.
So today, we're going to change up our format a little bit. Yeah. And we're going to interview a woman of science.
Danie and Jamie 7:49
By the end of this recording, we will all get it so that we are all together.
Where did that come from?
Trivia, right? I think so. That's how I that's how I know it.
Yeah, that's how I know it.
Yeah, it's a trivia thing. So when they introduce Like the the category of question you're going to get whenever they say science literally everyone goes... SCIENCE!
in your group or like everyone at the bar does that.
Everyone at the bar. Yeah. Any trivia I've ever done
Oh, I didn't know.
It's like a trivia subculture thing.
It is a subculture thing. I bet there's a subreddit for trivia.
Oh, there's a subreddit for everything!
True. We should find that subreddit. I just recently got into Reddit, which I don't know why it's taken me so long.
I've been on Reddit for like five years but only recently within the last year got really involved.
Yeah, so I've been on Pinterest been following Reddit / Pinterest.
Which is like a sub-subreddit of pinterest
You just went down a really deep hole there.
Well, they screenshot like the best of Reddit. And so you get kind of a highlights, which really is great because then I don't have to go find them. But I I don't know if anyone's a big Pinterest person. Are you Pinterest person?
I haven't been on for a while,
Oh, yeah, I am.
Have you ever gone into the fandoms of Pinterest?
I guess I'm not that good about it.
So if you get into any type of fandom culture on Pinterest, yeah, and you you know how you click an image and then you can do related and then if you have go down deep enough. Yeah. It's like when you go into the hole of YouTube or Wikipedia, it gets real weird.
Like I have found sub-sub fandoms that are like, sub-fandom plus porn.
Oh. So, way down there.
Pinterest. Yeah. And they're like, but it's like fan art, but also porn. Yeah, sorry.
Like Deviant Art?
I was laughing Carrie who just hurt herself.
I hit my funny bone.
Sorry. Sorry, Carry on.
What was your question? I got distracted. fandom. What was your question?
I don't know.
Okay. But Pinterest gets real weird when you start to dig deep into it.
Oh, like, yeah, like a Deviant Art. And then
once Yeah, and it's not like a Deviant Art, but then it's like Deviant Art plus porn.
Well, I think once you get into fandom deep enough, it's porn. It's Yeah.
That is true. And there's a lot of ships. A lot of shipping that I wouldn't expect.
Like, yeah, I could see that
or they don't know what that means. Shipping
I know what shipping is
Oh, you do? Okay. Do you know what shipping is?
like shipping a package?
It's a it's a term for fandoms where it's like relationship means relationship. So like, I'm shipping you know this perso plus, this person.
How Dare You think I don't know what that is
Well, I didn't know
like, sometimes it's like different fandoms together so like Elsa and jack Frost is a big shipping situation.
Whoa mind blowing
yeah so if you go on Pinterest and you look up Elsa and Jack Frost and then click click click click click then there's and it's porn. Yeah.
Oh okay interesting
but it's like Elsa and Jack Frost porn.
If you're into that you're welcome whoever's listening if you're into that. Now you know where to find that very specific...
Now you have that image burned into your brain
Speaking of port. On the way over here I was listening to this podcast called box of thoughts. I've never heard it before. It was very entertaining. And they brought up cake farts porn
You don't know what that is, Carrie?
Alright Nicole, come on.
Well, Nicole - who's never seen port. I'm going to recommend that this is the first one you watch based on the description I heard on my way over here
just because there's cake involved?
No, just because it's weird. But basically what it is from again just the description I heard in the podcast I have not watched this so I'm just gonna clarify is it is exactly what it sounds like somebody takes cake and puts it up there butt... and then farts. And by the description of the video the actress in the video starts by seductively removing her cardigain.
And this is like a thing?
And the school girl skirt, which what it has to do with cake. I don't know. And I guess it's a thing.
Eww. So, I know it's porn, but just thinking about the two elements involved. It's my six year old would like this.
yeah, okay, Not that I would let my six year old watch it.
okay kids inherently really really crumbly. How does that work?
Women AF 13:11
Well, I just want to say I feel like we need to say Women AF and mortar box media do not advocate showing six year old porn if there's cake or if there's not.
that was not what I meant. Nevermind!
Never show children any kind of porn. That's a bad idea. But let's go back to the physics of cake farts. We have the scientist here.
Well, in the absence of let's remove the porn from it. Let's talk about maybe you want to I don't know have a real tight rubber band. You want to try and get some cake in there?
Like a balloon a balloon? Yeah,
a non-blown up balloon.
Okay, you want to put cake in a balloon. Before we get into the physics of cake farts let's take a quick break.
Madison Story Slam Ad 14:18
Hey guys, it's Adam here from mortar box media and Madison story slam. just telling you that if you are in the Madison area on Saturday, February 15, you should come on out to the Madison story slam five year anniversary party. It's going to be a really great time. We've been doing storytelling events in Madison and a podcast for five years now. And we really want to celebrate with you. We've got 15 great storytellers lined up to tell some amazing stories. We're going to have food and as always, we're going to have great beer from Ale Asylum. We will be at the Wilmar center Doors open at six and stories start at seven, come early if you want to be sure to get a seat at a table, oftentimes those fill up very quickly. So come early, closer to that six o'clock opening door time. Again, you can find us Saturday, February 15, the day after Valentine's Day at the Willmar center in Madison, Wisconsin to celebrate five years of storytelling, five years of building community through storytelling, and five years of hearing my voice. Hope to see you there.
And we're back with cake farts. So, let's talk about physics. If you want to stuff cake in a balloon, is that what we're doing?
Yeah, that's what I'm wondering about.
Wait, can I ask what kind of scientist like oh, you know, cake Really? Well. Is that the science here?
No. Well, then, oh, no, I was just Yes. That's just how my brain works. I am a microbiologist. So okay. I'm a really tiny tiny, tiny biologist.
So do you study cake?
Do you study farts?
Then what? Let's talk about what you study and let's get off the topic of cake farts.
Let's talk about what does it mean to be a microbiologist?
So microbiology is a kind of a sub-study of biology. You know, things like animal biology, genetics at all under the giant biology. microbiology is the study of bacteria and viruses.
So what does that mean you do all day?
Yeah, I look for poop in water.
Okay. In drinking water?
Yes, And swimming water too
like animal poop... or?
It can be
Can you tell the difference?
That was part of my master's degree. Yes. You can only you can tell. You can tell the difference.
You had a master's degree in telling the difference between the source of the poop?
A masters in poop?
Interesting! No, I believe you. Yeah, very cool. So how did that research go?
It went, Okay. I got a paper out of it. So that was nice. So
a lot of looking at poop in a microscope?
No, no. So what I study or what what I studied is, is groundwater basically. And then Wisconsin that's really important here in the Midwest, Wisconsin.
What makes it important in Wisconsin?
We are one of the only states that gets 90 plus percent of its drinking water through the groundwater, a lot of other states use a lot of surface water like Milwaukee uses like Michigan,
Women AF 17:51
Most of the rest of Wisconsin uses groundwater
and just for those other people who might not understand the difference groundwater would be water under the ground under the surface. Yes. Okay. Not that I was one of those people, but I'm just wanted to clarify
It was me. I was confused. Let's be honest.
You're testing groundwater.
Yes. And it's especially important in Wisconsin because of our agricultural use.
Yes. That makes sense.
So a lot of manure application, depending on where you're at in the state, you know, how the geology is the manure that spread on the fields can sometimes get down into your groundwater. So it's important for us to
And what happens if it's say higher than you want it to be.
Well, you don't want any in there at all.
Oh, right. So any is too high. Yes.
I have a story. Sorry. I have a story, guys. So I went. So I was homeschooled. So I went to I gotta push that in there every single time. But when I one of our I went to like a little church for a little day camp, whatever, and I drink out of a, like a fountain and then that night I got violently ill. And then I found out a lot of other people got violently ill. And we found out that that church accidentally had an overflow of their sewer. And it got into the drinking water. So I know firsthand that that's not good. And it hurt.
It's really bad. Really bad. Yeah.
How old were you?
I was seven or eight.
You remember it?
Oh, yeah, I had to go to the emergency room because I couldn't breathe.
Yeah. It was like I was puking that much that I couldn't breathe. I couldn't stop myself. And then the minute I got in the car to go to the ER, I got better. My parents hate me for that one.
How long were you sick for?
I was sick for a full night. I think I couldn't. I was I was focusing on trying to just breathe for a solid three hours.
Oh my goodness.
Yeah. And then I went to the ER and I got a teddy bear.
So it was kind of a win win.
Yeah, still to this day. I can't drink out of a drinking from
also interesting that you call it a drinking fountain. What do you call it, Carrie?
What do you call it? Danie?
We always call it a bubbler.
What do you call it Jamie?
Yeah, see? Okay, cool.
So what do you do? If you find out that there is poop in the water.
Yeah. Before I answer that, I want to ask Nicole - Do you remember what you got? What you were diagnosed with at all? Or was it just,
it was just um, they didn't they couldn't really do anything because the minute I got to the ER, they couldn't really do a lot of tests because I was better and everything was out of my system. So they couldn't Much. The only way we found out was we found on other kids got it too. And then they linked it back to Oh, yeah, this
that's, that's really common in like epidemiology studies.
Really? What does that mean? Epidemiology?
Yeah. Um, so I'd have to Google it. I'm sure it's, you know, like Greek or Latin for something, but it's generally studying, like the spread of disease in the human population. Okay. So, so they will use things like, you know how much Pepto bismol at this Walgreens was purchased. Was it above average, and then they'll look and see... They're like the detectives of public health. It's kind of cool. That's
that's what they should call themselves.
Get themselves some badges, man.
Yeah, you can be the detective of poop and water.
Yes. I was. Yeah, that's Yeah. So What was the question you asked me before because I totally forgot.
Oh, I said what happens if there is poop in the water? What do you do if you find it?
Generally you bleach it.
The the groundwater?
How do you bleach? How do you bleach groundwater
through the well opening. So if you have groundwater there's going to be a well where they literally drill down into the ground and put a pump in there to pump the water up. Okay, so you have an access point down to the water, and you literally like
and isn't bleach bad, though too.
It's not great. But...
better than poop.
What about you said you mentioned agricultural stuff. How does that affect agricultural stuff?
Like the poop in the water?
Oh, if there's poop in the water? Yeah. Well, you don't want your cows and calves drinking that either. Yeah,
I mean, well, they get sick as well.
Yeah, they can their natural carriers for a lot of the stuff that makes us violently ill interesting. Yeah,
so maybe a dumb question. But how come when Nicole had poop in her water? Yeah, she became violently ill but say a dog. Yeah, just eat a whole turd. And not violently. Yeah, right.
It has more to do with their gut flora, like they can. It's like, if you grew up in maybe a third world country where the water wasn't so good, you can drink the water, but as the first world person going and visiting, you know, the don't drink the water thing, you know, make sure, that - they've developed kind of a natural immunity to that stuff. Okay, whereas
that makes sense.
We have not,
right, interesting. I mean, so.
So what drew you to this? Can I ask that?
Okay. Oh really? Is it really good money?
Since I was a kid, I wanted to be in the sciences. I always I I always knew that
science! Oh shoot.
We need to work on the timing.
I always knew I wanted to do science. I went in all through high school is just like, yeah, I'll figure it out. I'll figure it out. When I got to college, I was like, Okay, well, my mom's a nurse. And I've, you know, done some volunteer work at the hospital. That's kind of where my first job was. I figured, well, you know, I'll just try something in that field. So I went in for like, pre physician assistant. And after one year of human anat and Phys is I was not doing it. Yeah. So I was kind of driftless for about a year until a good friend of mine said, well, you're going to need microbiology. Anyway. So why don't you check out this microbiology class. I'd never heard of it? Really? It wasn't something that was studied in high school ever. Yeah, like for us anyway? No, no, yeah. But the department was really, really cool. I kind of found my people and was like, Oh, yeah, this is nice. I like this. And then when I graduated, I was looking for a job. And they said, all the jobs I applied for they said, You're not even remotely qualified. Oh, so Okay, well, what do I need to be qualified and they said, okay, a master's degree would get you into this type of position. So 2006 I got my master's degree.
This was right before the economy crashed.
Oh, no. It's really perfect timing.
So yeah, I I ended up getting hooked up with my advisor, Sharon, who was brand new to the university so she had a research grants that was able to pay me an assistantship So I learned to really like poop and groundwater because I got an assistantship to get through my graduate school.
Yeah, that makes sense. And that's where your experience was. So it probably just made the most sense. Yeah, right to continue to go in that area.
But you didn't work on poop ig water until you until
I got to graduate school.
Okay. So you just kind of kind of fell into it.
Yep. Yeah, I definitely fell into it.
And you were happy you did?
More or less?
Good? Fell into the poop in water.
It's really fun when we go to the State Fair, and we run around and collect all the different poop from the different animals.
Oh, that would be fun.
Do you get to go to the state fair for free?
Yeah. That would be cool.
When I was in research, or when I was in graduate school, it was covered by the state. So my ticket to the State Fair was graciously covered by the state so I could collect poop samples.
Could you ride the rides in between collecting the poop.
We didn't have time. I probably could have, but we didn't.
There's too much poop out there.
Yes. There's too much poop to collect. Got it. And just for my own curiosity, when you collect it is how much are you collecting? Is it like a test tubes worth? Is it like a larger amount?
More or less. No, it's we had 50 milliliter. Okay, slowly slow screw cap tubes. So we, I don't know if you can imagine what 50 milliliters is like,
like, like how I would imagine a large test tube-ish
Yeah, I would say
cool in my, my eighth grade science kit, we had test tubes and that's how I know how big they are
Your test tube knowledge
My test tube knowledge is vast. From one of those little mailing kit, you know you could rip the little card out of a probably an Archie comic book. That's what I was reading at the time. And you could mail it in for 8.95 plus shipping and handling. Now you could get your own science kit.
Women AF 27:58
So Okay, so So were you really smart in high school?
Yes we did it!
You say it like that. Why?
I could have been a lot of things? But I ended up being smart.
Was it? Wait? So we all have different high school experiences. So as Nicole has mentioned on every episode shw as homeschool and was until she was in High School. Carrie, I went to a private school, which you already know. And then Carrie went to a public high school. So we've all had very different experiences. And so I feel like different schools like different things are cool. So at your school, was it cool to be smart?
Not really, no, not really.
Were you cool? in my head You were.
No, Definitely not.
Did you ever feel pressured to dumb down the smartness?
to have more friends or be cool or whatever.
Maybe not in high school, because I really didn't care but I feel that I would say I feel more now. Okay. Yeah,
yeah. In what environments?
Maybe not now now, but I think when I was dating in my early 30s it was definitely pressure to be to not let on as much as I know. Okay, and even for applying for jobs right after graduation when I got my masters I literally had to leave my master's degree off of my resume. Really, because I couldn't get a job.
Because you were overqualified.
I was overqualified.
So playing dumb is... So I've done that for quite a while
in like the dating world. How How did that impact like Would you go out and like meet people and then realize like, in the moment that you'd have to play it down? Or was it even to get that initial communication? Or like, at what point did you feel the most pressure to like, downplay it socially,
until I knew they were like a real geek kind of like me, and then it'd be like, Oh, yeah, I you know, these, this, this and that, but right, then until I knew their geek cred.
out there, right. Yeah, I can. I can see that. And do you? Do you feel it now in your professional career at all?
Did you at any point like after you landed a job? Did you still feel like you had to like, downplay your awesomeness?
Yeah. Yeah, I would say.
So. Can you talk a little bit more about what it's like to be a smart woman in the career realm or what it's like to be... Let me, do you understand? My question is should I try to reword it to make more sense?
Maybe it may be a little rerfreshing the question?
I think a lot of times as women in our variety of career fields, right, like there's different aspects of ourselves, we feel that we need to downplay whether it's leadership or what people like to call bossiness, which is a you know, podcast topic all in itself, or whether it's like I've heard of people who've, like, dressed say, a little bit less attractive because they felt like people people being attracted to them was, like physically attracted to them was, you know, getting in the way or smartness, having to dumb that down or make it seem like you're not as smart or, you know, maybe downplaying your experience like of how much experience you have to make other people feel comfortable. Like Can you talk about what your experience has been like? Just being maybe the smartest person in the room and like how that feels like in your career path.
In my career path, it It hasn't, except for right after graduate school, it really hasn't been too bad. Because again, the economy was crap. And I had I just was happy to accept a job at that point. And I had I had to hide my master's degree and then I had to go to my boss later and be like, Oh, yeah, I have this I hid this and but I'm, I just wanted to, I just need money right now. So please don't fire me. But once I got a couple years experience under my belt, I didn't feel like it was as necessary to hide it.
Not once you have like, the career experience?
it's that weird, like conundrum of you know, you have to have an internship to get this job, but you can't have this job until you have the, you know, it's like, yeah,
yeah, you need experience, get the job, but you can't have the job without experience.
Right? Yeah, yeah,
yeah, I get that. A lot.
entry level position must have eight years experience. Yeah.
I actually also lied on my resume to get my first big corporate job. But I lied the other way and said I had a degree when I didn't. Maybe don't do that. Similar it was the economy was down. I needed a job. Yeah. You know, they, they believed me.
right? Yeah. Yes.
So don't do that. This is not me giving you advice. And I did eventually get that degree. It just took another 10 years.
But you got it.
But I got it!
Can I ask a question? How is is your field? I know. I mean, is it mostly men? Is it mostly women like what is the ratio?
I've been really, really lucky. So this kind of answers some of Danie's earlier questions. And yours. microbiology is a field that's, It's got a lot of women in it, at least especially on the lab. Yeah, and the things the research end where most of my studies and my interests lie is on the research side.
My undergraduate research professor was a woman. And then my graduate research professor was also a woman. So I've been really, really lucky to have very strong women in science role models around me from the get go. So as far as like schooling and that kind of stuff, I've never had felt like I needed to play down my intelligence around them because I looked up to them and they're smart as hell,
right. So So you've had a lot of people to inspire you on your career path.
Can you share some stories about maybe the biggest moments of inspiration or just some one person or multiple people who really like stand out to you as Like people who are like, ah, they're awesome.
People I know personally or like
or people just in the industry, maybe that inspire you, it doesn't have to be somebody that you know, personally.
kind of got you stumped on that one. I mean both of my advisor, research advisors. Bonnie in undergraduate and Sharon in graduate school, we're both you know, I very much looked up to them. Professors, you know, respected in their, in their field in their, in the microbiology departments in the soil science department. I see that they struggled with that kind of stuff a lot. You know, especially in academia, there's a very strong bias for inherently even in women, a bias towards men against women. Yeah. And I've seen them had to fight it. But, you know, I think their struggles, maybe are paving the way a little bit for people like me. I guess.
Do you consider yourself a role model. Now for the next generation of young girls in STEM
I don't think I'm a role model for anybody.
What do you think makes a good role model? I guess that's a question for anybody too - what do you guys think makes a good role model? Danie, what do you think?
Let's see, um, the people that I personally find the most inspirational are people who know who they are. Yeah. And who are not afraid to own who there. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Whatever that means, right. Like my last boss at my last Job is one of my favorite people. And I was a tech job. Or we were in we were, we created software, a tech software. And so it's male dominated. The people that are, I would say we were maybe one, one out of five people at that company were women. So there was a lot of guys, basically, and I don't think I have ever seen anybody walk into a tense situation and own it to the level that she could really Yeah. Like what you know, people say like, harnessing their Sasha Fierce or whatever. Yeah, like, I like to harness my Trisha. Like that. She brought that. And she also to that same degree, though, was not afraid to own when she didn't know something. Yeah. And I think that that speaks to a lot of confidence. You have to be really confident to say that you don't know something.
Or that you did something wrong or you messed up in some way. And so she always did that. And I think that that's pretty cool. Yeah. What about you guys, either of you.
Yeah, I was gonna say I'm kind of along those same lines is willing to make mistakes and accept that and own that and then turn it around and fight through it. That's that's admirable to me.
Yeah, I agree.
I would say people that are specifically women who have overcome adversity, and fought through and still, you know, I wouldn't say kept their head down but kept their get their head up and kept going and continue to do their work and power through and made a name for themselves. Yeah.
And sometimes and this kind of goes back to a separate conversation you and I were having over Christmas is like sometimes I feel like owning yourself is in that moment, doing the thing that you need to do to survive or like to get past this moment. And then like, for example, we were talking about sexual harassment. And in that, I don't know if you remember the conversation which is totally fine if you don't. But we were talking about I had experienced we I went out for a Christmas party with some of my co workers.
Oh, Yes, Yes, I remember that.
And we were we were at a bar and I was trying to be young hanging out with the youths which was a bad idea. We were at this college bar downtown and had to wait in line to get in and I was just like, why am I even here? Like the average age in this bar is 21. But I wanted to hang. It was already way past my bedtime and I'm like, okay, so We get up there we're trying to like hook a friend of ours up with somebody or like just get him talking to you know, real people.
Um, what are those
Oh you know, flesh and blood human. Oh yeah. Just get you know. And so we were all playing the part of wingman or wingwoman and this guy like came in with our party like pretending to be with us because we we paid off the doorman to get in. Which again, I don't even know why we're here. We're paying. We're paying off like bouncers whatever
You're so old you had to bribe the guy to get in the door.
That's the truth. We had to bribe the bouncer to let the grandparents in. And then we got in. And we then have to bribe another bouncer to get up on the top floor.
okay, why? Why? What's on the top floor?
I was just another floor or people I don't know. So many people and I'm claustrophobic and I'm just like, okay, there's too many people they're all young everyone's loud. You should be in bed. I could be at home with my slippers on watching Cold Case Files. Yeah, you know, but I'm here so we're having a we're having fun okay. And so I got really distracted but anyway so we we got up there and this guy is like talking to us and as we're waiting in line, like this guy standing next to me next to me so I'm talking to him because I I just talked to people if they're by me, and we were talking about our kids. There was nothing in this conversation that could have been misconstrued in any level. Yeah, okay. So we get up to the third floor and like he's standing next to me, but at this point, I'm not even talking to him. And he leans over in in a real creepy whisper. Oh, before this, he tells me that he's, he's married. He's got kids. He's on. He's here on business. So I'm like, oh, cool, you know, like, check out downtown or whatever, while you're here. It's Yeah, this thing is cooler. That thing's cool. Whatever. So I said to I was talking to my friends and like, he leans over and he goes, I just really want to grab your ass right now. In my ear, like where you can feel their breath. And I was like, you better fucking not. And then he walked away. And I was like, Okay, yeah, and then I told my friends, okay, this guy is being a creep. So like, Don't let him by us because he's creepy. Okay, so he didn't come back for a while. We were talking and I had to go the bathroom. So we went to the bathroom and I came back and motherfucker is waiting outside the bathroom and follows me back to the our group of friends. And at this point I'm like, this guy is clearly a serial killer and I will die. So, I tucked myself inside my friend so my back was to the bar and I put all five of my friends in between me and this guy,. And I said, Okay, this guy followed me to the bathroom. And then one of them started yelling at him. And you know, and then he left and it was fine we I was we I got home safe he didn't follow us whatever he left after my friend yell at him, but when I came back I felt like this huge amount of guilt of like not being the one to do the you know, I mean, not to be the one to like confront him and like Yeah, I just hiding behind my friends and yeah, like that was like a really a moment that I should have been, like,
you were just trying to survive, right? You were, you're probably replaying every single murder podcast.
Yeah. and there is a lot.
Yeah. If at the moment, you're feeling threatened? Yeah, you might hide and that is totally fine. Yeah, totally.
But also, let's take note did you actually physically say like you better fucking not.
Oh, yeah, I did say that.
Yeah, that's really I would have been like, ah, and ran through.
Yeah, that's all he took it up a notch and then you then you took it up a notch went up a notch. Yeah, yes. And that's why you were like someone else get in here and deal with it.
And cool. Cool you had friends to do that. Like that's really really good. Like you weren't alone in this situation or
and that you told somebody
Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
You told your friends and they knew what was going on. And you weren't just like slinking to the back and just keeping everything to yourself because right there, no one else was going to notice. Yeah. Yep. It's unfortunate but it is
Everyone is kind of distracted with their own mating rituals, right. When you're in college,
counting out your bills for the bouncer.
Getting up to the third floor trying to figure out are these people of age that honestly, we actually had a bed at one point to see if we could get some of the girls that were up there to show us their IDs. To see if they were real IDs? No way. Anyway, so clearly we were the coolest people at this bar and hanging out with the youths.
Yeah, good job. That's really good.
I hung until three!
Oh, That sounds terrible.
It really was. It was a Thursday night night too. So we took a hard Derail from science.. Oh, sorry, should we do that again? A hard derail from science
Women AF 45:55
We did it by the end of the episode, but it was Definitely an entertaining conversation we learned a lot about poop and water. Yeah. And if anyone is interested in sending questions, specifically to Jamie, if you can send them to our email at email@example.com contact us on our website or on all the socials Instagram Facebook Twitter at WomenAFpodcast and we will ask Jamie and you know if everyone's a fan we will bring her back on
Yes. I have so many more topics
Lots of stuff that we didn't get to. So yeah, I did feel really fast. Well once you start talking about poop in water
Oh man. Time just flies.
Don't forget about cake farts. Oh
That really could be an episode in and of itself.
Well, thank you so much for having me here.
It's past everyone's bedtime. So we're gonna go Thank you for listening. We are Women AF and we know you are to.
Women AF 47:11
Women AF is produced by mortar box media and engineered by Adam Rostad intro and outro music is Sq z by Shane ivers, check them out at Silvermansound.com and don't forget to subscribe and leave a review
Transcribed by https://otter.ai